Where are the VMs located?

[licensedtoquill]

I have asked a few times about Fusion crashing when I try to install Linux on my MacBook Pro which has already got Boot Camp installed into a VM. No one seems to know why.

I am continually trying to install this Linux, and Fusion continually either crashes or runs its VM from CD while I am trying to get it to install to the hard drive. It is certainly unresponsive during the instal process and wont let me give it the instruction to install to the hdd!

But now I am getting naming problems : Every time I try to install a new Vm it becomes called Ubuntu 64 bit (2) and (3) and (4) etc. I was told how to get rid of the VMs by deleting them from the menu, which is itself difficult to get to! But it doesnt seem to be deleting the VMs (which I AM shutting down from the VM menu)

I am used to these VMs being on the desktop. But they arent there and apparently deleting them from the menu, - as well as the files, - doesnt seem to be deleting the VMs so that I can start again

Is there anything I can do about this to delete ALL Linux VMs and start again please?

[admin]

By default, normal virtual machines are located in /Users/$/Documents/Virtual Machines.

I was told how to get rid of the VMs by deleting them from the menu, which is itself difficult to get to! But it doesnt seem to be deleting the VMs (which I AM shutting down from the VM menu)

What menu? I'm not sure what you're doing, but it doesn't sound effective since you're getting virtual machines with names like ...(2), ...(3) and so on. If you're talking about deleting virtual machines from the Virtual Machine Library, this isn't (necessarily) the same as deleting them from OS X, particularly in Fusion 1.x.

[licensedtoquill]

Well THAT was an interesting experience!! It seems that the OS doesn't like deleting VMs

The first virtual machine to be deleted caused multiple fracturing of the screen around the trash can when I dragged it to the can and this froze on the screen for about ten seconds. The second attempt at deletion (of the second VM) made the whole computer sluggish. At first the computer stopped working when I put the cursor on the VM in the file manager. After ten seconds or so it would let me move the VM to the trash but only fairly slowly. The third one replicated these problems only worse and didn't seem to want me to delete the VM or at first even find the trash! When I dragged the fourth VM to the trash, the whole computer froze as soon as the VM was deleted. Even the cursor stopped working. And 8 hours later the computer was still frozen with no immediate response even to the power button.

When I did manage to get it shut down, on re-opening the VMs, (only the Boot Camp one was open when the computer froze), it seems the windows one might either be seriously damaged or has been repaired by Scandisc? There are broken & truncated sectors all over the place which showed up in scandisks, especially in places like System Restore and in places which seemed to have VM in the name strings. and in all sorts of places which have .exe in the file names. Also the mouse isn't detected whatever that means, because the mouse IS actually working, but after the mouse has started working and during boot, Device Manager sees an unrecognized/identified device which it shows as a mouse and cant then find the hardware for it, whatever that means. I am now wondering what else I am going to find isn't working? Is there anything I can do about this? Does SFC /scannow work in a VM and will this necessarily assist?

Is this all a problem with Fusion 2 which hasn't been resolved during Beta testing?

[admin]

Normal virtual machines are just ordinary files. If you're seeing display artifacts and freezes when deleting them via the Finder (especially if Fusion isn't running), there's no way this can be related to Fusion - I would be worried about the health of your OS X install, and would make fixing it the top priority.

Hard reboots always carry the possibility of data loss or corruption. I think that either the hard reboot or whatever caused OS X to be unhappy with deleting the virtual machines caused the guest corruption. From a quick search on what SFC does, it seems like it would work in a virtual machine, but depending on how badly damaged the guest is, it may not succeed.

[licensedtoquill]

OK I see. There may well be a problem with the computer which despite being new, occasionally gives display problems such as the one shown

But there is a problem with Fusion as well. On one occasion I did mange to get this .iso of Linux to install properly and with the normal process. I apparently didn't note down the userID properly so I couldnt get the VM which appeared to be stable to start. So there is nothing wrong with the iso (or with compatibility with Fusion)

But on each subsequent attempted install of Linux, I have noticed that on opening the .ISO, firstly the cursor-clicker doesn't work properly in Fusion. As an example of this, the first install screen of Hardy Heron shows a language screen with a countdown which I can't override. This may not be important but the next bit IS:

Thereafter the install process doesnt go to the install screen with choices and options (install to HDD, run from .iso, press F6 etc etc), it goes straight to install from CD (and does so). Thereafter it wont install from the VM onto the hard drive by using the INSTALL icon on the linux desktop (though this may well be intended: It may well be that you cant install this way in Fusion).

Do you have any idea why it suddenly wont give me the option to install to HDD please?

(I am grateful to you for your quick responses on this)

[WoodyZ]

What Linux is this and what it the download URL for the ISO image and the ISO images name?

[admin]

Um, that picture (especially if you're not running Fusion), coupled with your earlier observations, strongly suggests bad hardware - I'd be pretty worried if my MacBook started doing that. If possible, bring it in to an Apple store to be looked at.

[licensedtoquill]

I am pretty sure that the .iso is the bottom one on centre of the the http://www.vmware.com/appliances/ page. VMWare seems to want to keep it a big secret that someone has put it there for some other product so all I know is that when I search for VMs for Fusion, I get sent to that page.

[admin]

I am pretty sure that the .iso is the bottom one on centre of the the http://www.vmware.com/appliances/ page.

Could you be more specific (e.g. at least the name)? When I went there, the bottom center column was a list of virtual appliances, not .isos, and the last one was an Ubuntu 8.10 Alpha 5.

[WoodyZ]

Well you providing incomplete information is worthless and a waste of my time trying to help so I guess I won't even try. Anyway I'd do as Eric suggested and get you Mac checked out first.

[licensedtoquill]

Yes, I thought I had identified it sufficiently enough for anyone to see which one I was using and it seems that i did:

That is the exact one.

[licensedtoquill]

Please can someone explain the difference between a virtual appliance and an .iso file whch I thought you use ("install") to create a VM? Is there a difference for the purposes of installing Linux on a Mac using Fusion between a virtual appliance and a virtual machine?

When you click on that link, you seem to be taken to a page where you can download the distro which is mentioned. I dont know what a torrent is so I download the .iso. Is there some reason I shouldnt be using a virtual appliance? I thought (obviously wrongly) that as I went to the virtual appliance site and downloaded the .iso to create a virtual machine and this worked when I first did it, this was the way it was done.

Where did I go wrong?

[Technogeezer]

An ISO (.iso file extension) is a disk image file representing the contents of a CD-ROM (it's a shorthand for ISO 9660 disk format, which is a standard for data written on a CD-ROM). It's a common method to distribute software and data. Since it's an image of a real CD, it can be used to burn a CD, mount it on your running OS (Mac OS, Linux, and yes, even Windows with the right tools can mount ISOs and make them look like CDs), or use them in VMware products as a look-alike CD-ROM.

ISOs can also be bootable, which makes the format ideal for delivering operating system distributions (either burn the CD or configure Fusion to use the ISO as a CD-ROM device).

A virtual appliance is a pre-built, pre-configured virtual machine. Installing a virtual appliance is not like configuring and building a new Windows VM. You don't use Fusion's wizards to create a new virtual machine, boot from a CD-ROM, or perform a fresh OS install. All that work has been done for you. You just take the download of the virtual appliance and extract the files to your hard drive. After extraction, you should see a folder representing the appliance, and inside are the virtual disks and other VMware pieces that are the virtual machine. You then tell Fusion to open this folder and... voila. You have a running virtual appliance.

ISOs can be used to deliver virtual appliances. Once you download the iso, you mount it as a disk image, and you can then extract the appliance. Now they may not have Mac OS instructions on how to mount the ISO - but it's not hard. Simply double click on the ISO, and it should appear as a disk drive in the Finder.

An operating system distribution is NOT a virtual appliance. You need to go through the steps to create a virtual machine, boot the CD/ISO, and run through the installer, which copies the files to your virtual machine's disks. After installation you run off the virtual machine's disks.

Now, some Linux distributions have what's known as a "live CD", which means that the OS can run off the CD-ROM or an ISO without needing to be installed on the hard drive. The operating system can then be installed on the hard drive if you like it. That requires you to create a VM with Fusion and boot off the ISO. It would be stretching the definition to refer to this as a "virtual appliance" - you still have to go through the work to configure a hard drive, run the process to copy the Live CD to your virtual machines' hard drive, and then configure it.

Message was edited by: Technogeezer - added discussion of Linux bootable 'Live CD"s

[licensedtoquill]

Well that makes it fairly clear, - that there is a whole lot more to creating a VM than what is suggested by the Fusion instructions. Which say that you just point the installation process to the .iso of the linux distribution and Hey Presto, let it do the rest. It also explains to some extent why the installation of the VMware tools say they are installed in Windows XP but when I open the VM which is the BootCamp partition, I am told that I havent got tools installed. It also explains why I cant ever install VMWare tools in any linux VM. Again it seems there is a hwole lot more to it than justhitting INSTALL VMWARE TOOLD in the VMWare menu once a VM seems to have been created. What I need are pre-configured Virtual Appliances

Is there a repositiory anywhere of vitual appliances either in iso form or which I can burn to a DVD to install the VM which have been created for Fusion please? I have downloaded a few by now but (for example) when I unpackage what I have downloaded, I find in the Install.txt that the Vm is for something called Player and (for example) the keyboard is South African. I was under the obviously mistaken impression that if a VM had been created for VMWare it would open or install in Fusion.

[admin]

I don't think we're talking about the same thing. The file I got to is a virtual appliance, is already installed, and doesn't match your description at all (e.g. no language screen, no install process, no install icon on desktop).

This is why it's really important for you to give precise directions to where to get files - regardless of my (in)ability to guess what you were talking about, your description was not sufficient. For example, if I wanted to describe the file I got, I would say something like:

From http://www.vmware.com/appliances/ I clicked on "Ubuntu 8.10 Alpha 5" at the middle of the bottom of the screen. This took me to http://www.vmware.com/appliances/directory/1394, and I naturally went to the "Download this Appliance". After ignoring the registration page, I landed at http://vmplanet.net/node/69 and used the "Ubuntu VMware Image" link in the middle of the page. I unzipped the resulting file and opened the unzipped .vmx in Fusion.

[admin]

Well that makes it fairly clear, - that there is a whole lot more to creating a VM than what is suggested by the Fusion instructions. Which say that you just point the installation process to the .iso of the linux distribution and Hey Presto, let it do the rest.

I don't think Technogeezer's contradicted this at all, and you can in fact do that with some guest OSes (XP, Vista, Ubuntu 7.10/8.04, some versions of RHEL, etc.).

It also explains to some extent why the installation of the VMware tools say they are installed in Windows XP but when I open the VM which is the BootCamp partition, I am told that I havent got tools installed. It also explains why I cant ever install VMWare tools in any linux VM. Again it seems there is a hwole lot more to it than justhitting INSTALL VMWARE TOOLD in the VMWare menu once a VM seems to have been created.

Not really. The common explanations for these are that the menu sometimes gets out of sync and says "Install VMware Tools" even when you have them already installed, needing to be logged in to install Tools, and that Linux has the problem (some would say feature) of requiring extra steps. Check out Help > VMware Fusion Help > Creating Virtual Machines > VMware Tools. Without exact details of your setup, I can't say which apply to you.

Is there a repositiory anywhere of vitual appliances either in iso form or which I can burn to a DVD to install the VM which have been created for Fusion please?

You already found it, http://www.vmware.com/appliances/ (except I don't think anyone packages virtual appliances as an .iso, that would be silly - you can do it, but I don't think anyone does. They're generally zipped).

I have downloaded a few by now but (for example) when I unpackage what I have downloaded, I find in the Install.txt that the Vm is for something called Player and (for example) the keyboard is South African. I was under the obviously mistaken impression that if a VM had been created for VMWare it would open or install in Fusion.

VMware products share a common format, so with a few exceptions (e.g. host-specific paths or specific product capabilities), you can run virtual appliances for other VMware products in Fusion. This doesn't mean it'll be completely set up, though - for example, the vmplanet Ubuntu 8.10 Alpha 5 virtual appliance mentioned earlier in the thread doesn't seem to have Tools installed at all (and even if it did, they probably wouldn't exactly match the version that came with Fusion so you would have to update them).

The keyboard layout (and other setup) is determined by whoever made the virtual appliance - in most (all?) cases, this is not VMware. We simply provide a place for people to list their virtual appliances.

[Technogeezer]

Well that makes it fairly clear, - that there is a whole lot more to creating a VM than what is suggested by the Fusion instructions. Which say that you just point the installation process to the .iso of the linux distribution and Hey Presto, let it do the rest.

The Fusion instructions are fairly clear that if you're creating a virtual machine, you need some kind of OS distribution. Fusion does provide the New Virtual Machine Assistant to help automatically generate the new VM, and then boot the installation media ISO or CD. The Linux installer takes over from there.

The Getting Started documentation is just that - Getting Started. The full details about installing VMs and VMware Tools can be found in Fusion's Help menu. It's too bad they don't give you the PDF of this document along side the Getting Started guide. It's an absolutely invaluable reference document.

It also explains to some extent why the installation of the VMware tools say they are installed in Windows XP but when I open the VM which is the BootCamp partition, I am told that I havent got tools installed.

VMware tools are to be installed in each VM. If you have two Windows VMs (even if one is the Boot Camp) you need to install the tools in each one of them.

It also explains why I cant ever install VMWare tools in any linux VM.

If you used Easy Install when you created the VM, it should install the tools for you automatically. If it didn't you can install them yourself - but, choosing "Install VMware Tools" from the Fusion menu only makes the tools available as a CD-ROM within your Linux machine. You need to install them from there (they're not installed automagically like Windows) - instructions are in the Fusion Help.

I have downloaded a few by now but (for example) when I unpackage what I have downloaded, I find in the Install.txt that the Vm is for something called Player and (for example) the keyboard is South African. I was under the obviously mistaken impression that if a VM had been created for VMWare it would open or install in Fusion.

Most appliances should work in Fusion even if they say for "VMware Player" or "VMware Workstation" or "VMware Server" as the virtual machine formats are for the most part compatible. What may be different is the instructions - they tend to be for Windows or Linux variants of VMware's products.

[licensedtoquill]

Well I think I am getting a bit closer and didnt realise that there was something called Easy Install. I have certainly never used it which is possibly why all my installs have been so difficult. I thought that you just pressed OPEN and followed the directions, clicked on an .iso (as we have been discussing) and let it do the rest

I also suspect that there is something else I should be trying which is suggested by your statement "and opened the unzipped .vmx in Fusion" which I have to admit I didnt understand at all.

[WoodyZ]

You really need to take the time and stop what your doing an read the documentation!

VMware Fusion menu bar > Help > VMware Fusion Help

How anyone expects to use software without reading the documentation is absurd especially a product like Fusion. While VMware truly makes it easy to run other OSes at the same time on the Host nonetheless the User needs to and must take responsibility and RT*M!

[licensedtoquill]

Yes, I accept that you have to read the help files but I have tried reading everything in sight

(especially VMware Fusion menu bar > Help > VMware Fusion Help)

and watching all videos and am even more confused than before. This is really one exceptionally complex product rendered even more complex by it's help files being geared pretty much solely towards Windows users. Nowhere do I find any references to any other OSs. I can see numerous ways to invoke windows, use a VM with windows in it, pick up a Boot Camp installation into an appliance, manage the size of a VM using Windows, switch from parallels using Windows but nothing to show me why it was that when I first 'installed' Intrepid Ibis, I was given the option of either running from a CD or installing to the Hard drive but never thereafter have I seen this option. And all when in reality, for most users who want to use Windows, everything is done pretty much automatically! (YES, but look at all those confusing error messages: "you do realise you cant use your CD/DVD unit, dont you? Go on at your peril and we will disconnect it" whatever that means. "There are other VMs running, arent there?" with no explanation for what this actually means: Does it mean that I shouldnt be creating a Linux VM when I have Boot Camp running in its VM? If not, why on earth is it giving this messsage?) It is as if the person who dreamed up all those erroneous Windows error messages got fired and went to work for VMWare screwing up things.

And even worse, I am being told to use something I cant find at all, called a Wizard. Nowhere is a Wizard mentioned and as far as I can see, the only way of starting up a new VM into which to install Linux is to go to OPEN??

Import doesnt seem to do much besides give me a whole load of grayed out options and I have unzipped whole loads of Ubuntu VAs without any way of figuring out how to install the VMDK files created.

Is there some reason why everyone wants to keep so quiet about how to install Linux? Is it because Linux is designed to be only for Anoraks? The newest versions are really quite user friendly and even have desktops!

What is most extraordinary is how people have even customised linuces for VMware and pre-packaged them for people like me to use without our having to compile everything ourselves. So what is this extraordinary secrecy? Or is it that the Version 2 still is flaky even after it has come out of beta? Was it rushed to market too quickly? Is this why it is constantly asking whether to install TOOLS, even after they are supposed to have been installed?

I can see that there is a hint of how to overcome this secrecy in a video called "VMware Fusion 2.0 Use Virtual Disks" but as soon as it gets somewhere near to letting users into the secret, suddenly it becomes just another way of running (GUESS WHAT) Windows!!

Finally I thought I was getting somewhere with defining the differences between VMs and VAs while now I am being told that there is something apparently even more complex called a VD!

Surely a pre-configured appliance should be the easiest thing to use, especially if it includes tools? Why on earth is this so difficult to use? Is there some reason or is Fusion just flaky and should I just battle on with it and hope that at some stage it will get it right because if I did once manage to get Linux installed on the HDD, I must be doing it right?

I am doing a review of this software for a journalist private forum and do actually need to know the answers to these questions. If a member of the public tries to use Fusion for anything other than a simple Windows installation, will everything be as counter-intuitive (or flaky) as I have found it?